yuletide_coal | It's always coalest before the dawn

Creative.

Seriously, though, the whole thread is people going on about how Ars Belli is such a special case because she's an actual confirmed Nazi and we need to shun her, and how banning Nazi RPF is not going to lead to banning anything else potentially controversial. Except apparently it does. Unless Aja is a confirmed serial killer somehow? Don't you see that this undermines the whole argument?!

ooh you really showed me :) and i'm impressed with your grammar given how deep your fingers have crawled into ars_belli's rectum

it does not undermine the whole argument because you're misunderstanding the whole argument. recent serial killer rpf wasn't rejected because nazi rpf was rejected. recent serial killer rpf was rejected because it was also tasteless and not suitable for yuletide.

Sorry if my grammar isn't up to your standards.

recent serial killer rpf was rejected because it was also tasteless and not suitable for yuletide.

Yes, and precisely that's what I'm arguing against. Don't you get that I DGAF about arse_beli? It doesn't matter if it's the banning of the Nazi RPF or the serial killer RPF that sets the precedent. Either way, shit that's labeled "tasteless" gets banned, which doesn't rule out that something "tasteless" you like might also get banned in the future.

We don’t care if you GAF about this imagined civil exchange rights violation. You’re basically an anti-anti at this point. Oh noes, hypothetical fandoms may be harmed at some time, even though there is no proof of it happening when noms happened in good faith by confirmed non-creeps! Better start wank for the tasteless frige, aka LITERAL NAZIs and evergreen wanker Aja (who was an original anti archetype during the CC Harry Potter days lmao like wtf) to be able to do whatever they want just so I can request my stuff, even though nobody has a problem with my stuff and it has been in Yuletide fine before. Just in case!

Newsflash, asshole: your stuff isn’t going to be banned. If it is, you can find a loophole like ars_belli and Aja do every year.

You’re basically an anti-anti at this point.

.... is this supposed to be an insult?

I don't want any kinds of moral boundaries on fanfic because they always depend on the person who sets them. But hey, it's cool if you do and if you think only "confirmed non-creeps" are allowed to make nominations now. That's not worrying at all.

You’re insane.

Just make your own Atrocities Exchange if you're so worried about this kind of shit not being allowed in Yuletide. No one will stop you.

NA

Look man, I kind of understand where you're coming from with the slippery slope thing, but the slope can slip the other way too. You can still defend people's ability to write controversial stuff in YT, without defending literal Nazi sympathizers who want sympathetic fic about actual historical WWII Nazis.

Out of all the "controversial" stuff in fandom, this is such a distant outlier. It's so distant you can't even *see* underage sex and incest ships from where ars_belli is standing. We're not losing anything by drawing a line in the sand that is so far away from anything worth defending.

DA

The fact that they admit to wanking about the Horror exchange says it all. I also think that banning RPF for that was dumb but if that wad the perk the mod wanted in exchange for their running it then more power to ‘em. But I didn’t sign up for the exchange. I don’t think its a canary in the exchange coal mine any more than this person making a Yay, Nazis! Fest would have me worried other exchanges would let Nazi RPF in. Exchanges are run by people for free, and people have opinions, just like any politician might.

This person has Mod Opinions that are strong enough to warrant them Being An Actual Mod because their need to wank anywhere they hear a dog whistle means they want other people to cow to them, but they’re too lazy to actually do that and so they bitch at what other people with Mod Opinions do.

+trillions

Is Aja participating this year? I don't recall seeing a letter.

Yeah, Aja's on the spreadsheet. Looks like no letter link.

Fandoms are Angels in America - Kushner (Broadway Cast 2018) RPF, Angels in America - Kushner, and Sakeru Gum "Long Long Man" Commercials.

1. Andrew Garfield
2. Andrew Garfield
3. Something she can spin into a DailyDot article so please, if you worry about nonfans reading or talking about your fics, lock it. If you like attention, then abuse Aja’s need to blow the lines of fandom being by fans for fans away to your advantage.

Either way, shit that's labeled "tasteless" gets banned

Nice scare quotes around tasteless. As writing Nazi RPF is some noble endeavor that’s being unfairly mislabeled.

Also, I’m guessing you’re willfully missing the point here, but the stuff that’s being banned isn’t fictional canons about Nazis or serial killers or about RL concepts with fictional characters. The banned stuff is RL events and tragedies that still has living victims or living relatives of victims, or, in the case of Nazis, the ideology and culture is seeing a greater revival in certain political climates. It’s not something that will ever truly die.

Things aren’t being banned “arbitrarily.” They are being banned because RL people are still being affected by these events.

I was born in the wrong era 😩😩😩😩😩😩😩💦💦💦💦💦 I can’t write about the [tries to read smudged writing on my hand] Pulse massacre because it happened too recently! Oh what I wouldn’t give to be born in 2200 so I could get the Yulefic of my dreams.

(I’m so tired of this concern trollie’s “No, I’m not pro-any of these things, it’s about the Ethics of Fanficfion Exchanges” bullshit. An exchange is a community, communities have rules and norms, if you don’t like them, make your own. The majority like the norms and would leave if they changed.)

They are being banned because RL people are still being affected by these events.

Oh, spare us the concern-trolling for the victims. RL people are affected by all kinds of awful events. I remember that person walking into an exchange post on FFA a couple of weeks back arguing that noncon shouldn't be allowed in the exchange because they were a rape survivor. Would you think that's justified too? Where does it stop? People are victims of cancer, natural disasters, domestic abuse, and so many other things that are not banned from Yuletide, nor should they be.

In case of Nazis, how is it any more respectful on the victims to write fic glorifying (possibly real life) Nazis from a fictional canon? That's why the ban is "arbitrary". Because you can't ban everything that affects RL people in a horrible way.

real life is where it stops lmao it isn’t that deep.

you can still write it for yourself (or like others have said, make your own exchange even.) but the majority of people don’t want to ask for or request it.

if it becomes such a big deal that everyone wants it and the mods won’t change the rules, yuletide will die and that’ll be the right course of action.

until then, you sound like someone who is mad they can’t nom a movie that comes out in december of 2020 in this years yuletide. it’s a small fandom! but there’s arbitrary dates rules so you’re sol. has nothing to do with the parameters of the exchange. make your own true yuletide and roll out the red carpet for nazis while you’re at it.

This isn’t about noncon. Do you actually understand that? Do you, like, legitimately understand that no one but you is talking about banning noncon from Yuletide? Noncon has nothing to do with this argument. It’s about banning Nazi RPF from Yuletide and disliking someone who literally masturbates to RL Nazis. That is the issue here. WTF is all of this, “Banning Nazis will inevitably lead to banning noncon”? It was never even on the fucking table.

Also, I love how you evidently think that it’s “concern-trolling” to care about Holocaust survivors or the people who are currently targeted by Neo-Nazis. Being worried about violent homophobia or racism or anti-Semitism is just “concern-trolling,” sure.

Hey, at least they didn't say "virtue-signaling."

You might not think the RPF / FPF distinction matters, but it's pretty clear that fandom as a whole is more willing to accept the latter rather than the former.

We've got at least one real-life serial killer in the tagset this year from a fictional canon (Ed Kemper, in "Mindhunter"), and there hasn't been an outpouring of controversy. So there's clearly a normative line there, even if you don't see it.

Haha, I wondered when all the Ed Kemper/Holden prompts were going to hit _coal.

"arguing that noncon shouldn't be allowed in the exchange because they were a rape survivor. Would you think that's justified too?"

Was anyone in the exchange planning to write stories about that actual real person, the one who brought up the complaint, being raped? Would that be acceptable to you?

There is a difference between writing about terrible things happening to fictional characters, and writing about terrible things that happened to real people. You can write whatever you want about fictional characters because they're only figments of your imagination and they don't have feelings. That is not equivalent to exploiting real people's suffering just for the sake of a story.

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli

Re: ars_belli